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‘Tis (out of) the Season
April 2, 2015
By Rob Kaminski
MHSAA benchmarks editor
Those who live in close proximity to high schools throughout Michigan don’t even need a calendar to know what time of year it is when a new sports season begins.
Whistles piercing through the hum of their air conditioners on the first Monday morning in August mark the start of fall from nearby football facilities. The ping of aluminum as sidewalks and grass re-appear from winter’s grip signifies the start of spring.
Office supply stores could see calendar sales soar in those households – or occupants might at least do a double-take when checking smartphone calendars – in the near future if MHSAA out-of-season coaching regulations are modified. The familiar sounds of the seasons could resonate in non-traditional months as well.
A major topic of the recent MHSAA Update Meetings and AD In-Services in the fall was the possibility of revamping the regulations regarding out-of-season contact for school coaches with school teams during the school year. The Summer Dead Period would remain in place and has been largely supported by membership since it was implemented for the 2007-08 school year.
It should be noted that out-of-season revision is not a certainty, but simply in the exploratory stage at this point.
Yet, the time was ripe to initiate discussion on this topic in the fall. The growth of non-school athletic programs and demands placed upon students by such entities in recent years was one factor. The difficulty the MHSAA has enforcing – and schools have interpreting – current out-of-season coaching regulations is another factor.
“The fundamental question is how to allow more contact between coaches and students out of season without encouraging single-sport participation,” MHSAA Executive Director Jack Roberts said.
Can this be done? Can trends toward specialization and away from multi-sport participation be reversed through greater contact periods for each sport within the school year?
Proponents of this school of thought believe that time otherwise spent with non-school coaches would be best served with education-based coaches who, in theory, would be on the same page with peers at their school, all encouraging multi-sport participation.
“Part of the explosion of AAU and club involvement has been the perpetuation of the notion that without additional training and competition, students will not reach their potential nor maximize their chances of being recruited by colleges,” said Scott Robertson, athletic director at Grand Haven. “When our high school coaches have the ability to provide a similar experience, but with an education-first mindset regulated by athletic directors, the expectations of student-athletes by coaches can be tempered.”
It is a lively debate that will be picking up momentum for the remainder of this school year and into the next.
Following are some of the concepts and comments from the fall, with key points from a statewide survey to be published later this week. The MHSAA's Representative Council discussed these results at its March meeting, and action is possible during its final meeting of the school year in May.
Let's begin
Perhaps the most criticized, misinterpreted, ignored, and/or difficult to enforce rule in the MHSAA Handbook resides in Regulation II, Section 11 (H): the three- and four-player rule for coaches out of season during the school year. (See bottom of this page.)
Debate has long spiraled in dizzying circles around definitions such as “open gyms,” “under one roof,” “conditioning,” “drills,” and other components.
“One of the problems is the MHSAA finds this specific rule difficult to enforce and interpret,” MHSAA Associate Director Tom Rashid said. “Another perceived problem is that there might be a disconnect between school coaches and students out of season, which might be driving students toward non-school programs.”
It’s simple to recognize lightning rods, but quite another to construct a device for harvesting the sparks in a productive manner. To that end, Rashid prepared an outline for discussion on the topic as he hit the trails around Michigan this fall for Update Meetings and AD In-Services.
“We felt we needed to see if we could do better,” Rashid said. “Rather than say to 600 ADs, ‘What do you think about out-of-season coaching rules?’ we asked about a new concept. We created a starting point for discussion.”
The basic premise brought forward to the masses was this: a voluntary contact period of one month to six weeks with a limit of 10 or 15 days of contact in that period – and perhaps three in any one week – between a coach and his/her athletes out of season with any number of students, grade 7-12. Due to large participation numbers in football, some consideration was given to limiting the number of players in any one out-of-season session to 11, thus not creating “spring football.”
A straw poll from the gatherings in the fall indicated nearly 70 percent of attendees in favor of “contact periods” versus the current rule, prompting a detailed survey to all member schools sent in October to further measure the climate and hone in on specifics for desired changes.
“It was a very open process with great discussion,” Rashid said. “All size schools, all demographics, and all corners of the state weighed in.”
As always, the devil is in the detail, and the October survey yielded plenty of detail.
Numbers favor no numbers
As mentioned earlier, nearly 70 percent of attendees at MHSAA fall gatherings indicated that they might prefer a rule that specified coaching contact periods outside their sport during the school year, as opposed to limiting the number of student-athletes per session.
The ensuing survey sent to member schools in late October reflects that sentiment in schools of all sizes, and in all zones of the state. On the topic of counting contact days out of season with no limit on the number of students involved, more than 72 percent of 514 responding schools favored the plan. Class A schools led the way with nearly 76 percent in support. Class D schools chimed in at 69 percent in favor. Support was strong across the zones of the state as well, led by the Detroit metro area (Zone 3) at 76.5. The middle of the state (Zone 5) was the low, but still found close to 60 percent in favor of such a revision.
The survey revealed consistencies across the board relative to the amount of three- and four-player sessions currently utilized by schools of different sizes, and the support and opposition to questions regarding revised regulations on the topic. For instance, nearly 50 percent of Class A schools indicate that their coaches work with students under the current rule most every week during the offseason, while 40 percent of Class D schools report that most of their coaches never utilize the three- or four-player rule at all out of season. Not surprisingly then, in questions posed where three-and four-player stipulations might still exist, the larger schools favored such changes at a higher rate than the smaller schools.
Survey data also reveals a reason for such opposition at lower-enrollment schools: a simple numbers game. In Class C and D, the majority of schools report that 60-80 percent of their student-athletes participate in more than one sport. So, with more students busier year-round than at their larger school counterparts, there are fewer people to attend out-of-season sessions.
Similarly, the concept of extending the current preseason down time for all sports was supported more in Class C and D schools than Class A and B.
“It is always a challenge for individual schools to see things from the other schools’ perspectives,” Rashid said. “It’s hard for people to say, ‘It might be different for us, but for the greater good, we might have to change our culture here.’”
But, that line of thinking is certainly understood at Chelsea High School, a Class B school of more than 800 students. Athletic director and football coach Brad Bush is an advocate of multi-sport participation, regardless of school size.
“The current three- or four-player rule benefits kids by developing skills, but does not force kids to feel pressure to be at a full practice,” Bush said. “Changing this rule could reduce the number of multiple-sport athletes. Our staff and league is united in believing that changing this rule could be a big mistake.”
Outside influence
Part of the balancing act in attempting to revise out-of-season rules is to encourage greater participation on school teams, while not promoting specialization.
Interestingly, a number of schools in the survey reported that they have policies in place limiting in-season athletes from attending sports-specific training from out-of-season coaches. The percentages ranged from 27.6 percent in Class D to 41 percent in Class B.
Most schools allow weightlifting during the season, followed in decreasing order by three- or four- player workouts, conditioning and open gyms. However, more than 40 percent of responding schools have in place a policy prohibiting non-school competition for in-season athletes. The message seems to be that if activity is taking place, the preference is for it to be under supervision, and for that supervision to come from school coaches.
“If a coach is going to hold three workouts per week out of season, a student may leave another sport to play in the offseason of their preferred sport,” Rashid said. “As such, many ADs identified that it would be the role of each school to regulate out-of-season coaching. Right now, the ADs have to keep a handle on out-of-season activities and if the rules change, depending on their demographic, they might need to be involved even more.”
With advance planning, an environment can be created in which all of a school’s sports can exist in harmony and encourage multi-sport membership.
“Athletic directors can guide all coaches on their staffs to work together to create 12-month calendars that focus on the needs of kids and respect the desire of many to participate in multiple sports,” Robertson said. “In doing so, coaches can work to avoid overlaps in important opportunities where kids may be put in win-lose situations. With careful planning student-athletes will be afforded more opportunities to train and develop with their classmate peers and within their own communities.”
Chris Ervin, athletic director at St. Johns High School, is one of many in the camp that believes the current system accomplishes a school’s missions when properly supervised.
“Our coaches have ample opportunities to coach in the three- or four-player setting, and our athletes have plenty of opportunities to improve their skill sets through open gyms which are not coach-directed,” Ervin said.
Others agree that any change might introduce unwanted consequences. One source, an administrator in a strong football community, speculates in that town and others like it, football programs could smother other sport programs by scheduling full workouts on top of other in-season sports. Voluntary or not, it is opined that kids would gravitate toward the out-of-season football workouts if that’s the signature sport in town.
Ervin can see the same point. “I don't see this affecting my role too much, but I do believe this could lead to even more specialization. For example, if football coaches are able to work with their players 11 at a time in the offseason, I believe athletes will feel more pressure to be part of that football workout while they are in-season with another sport.”
Under another scenario, school coaches might someday be allowed to coach non-school teams during the school year. The rationale is that if students are participating outside the school campus anyway, wouldn’t it be better that they are coached by school personnel so that the educational message is delivered appropriately?
Add to this the fact that 100 percent of surveyed schools reported conducting open gyms in basketball and 66 percent in volleyball – the two most high-profile AAU sports – would it benefit schools to have trained personnel in those non-school leadership roles?
“This would connect our coaches to school kids but also could have the unintended consequence of specialization,” Rashid said. “However, the coaches in place would be our coaches, whereas currently we don’t have a say in the AAU coaches of our students.”
Not yet. This topic on the survey was favored by roughly 60 percent overall, but an equal 20.4 percent were at opposite ends of the spectrum strongly in favor and strongly against, with the highest percentage falling just above lukewarm.
By Class, the C and D schools were slightly more opposed to this idea than Class A and B. Why? Very often, in the smaller communities, there are no non-school opportunities; school sports are the only option.
Robertson believes that incorporating a revised out-of-season coaching plan could assist families financially in the long run.
“By having the ability to include larger numbers of kids in development activities and allowing for a limited number of competitions, there is a strong likelihood that students and their families will choose the out-of-season activities offered by their schools over the AAU/club activities that exist,” Robertson said. “In doing so, there will be no rental of outside gyms, no mandatory club fees, and reduced costs to families.”
Not all ideas have elicited opposing views. One item on the docket that schools uniformly opposed was the possibility of scrimmages within the out-of-season contact period. Most schools indicate a preference for these periods to be instructional only.
Just a tweak
Perhaps the current rule just needs a splint and not a full cast. Maybe it’s not broken after all.
The most popular proposal to emerge from the survey was simply the removal of three little words in the current regulation: “under one roof.”
More than 80 percent of schools favored removing the phrase “under one roof” from Regulation II, Section 11(H) 2. a., which means as long as only three or four students are receiving coaching, then others may be in the facility working on conditioning, or in groups on their own.
Receiving close to 70 percent support from schools is the prospect of removing the portion of Handbook Interpretation 237 which currently prohibits schools from setting up rotations. This would allow a coach to work with dozens of players, three and four at a time.
And, Robertson says, in less time than coaches are currently expending.
“Most high school coaches already commit an enormous amount of time to the offseason development of student-athletes,” he said. “By removing the limit on number of athletes they can have contact with at one time and by placing a limit on the number of dates they can actually have this direct instructional contact, the net gain will be fewer dates, but with a greater impact.”
Rashid forecasts slight modifications of current rules rather than wholesale changes, at least in the near future.
“It wouldn’t surprise me if a few changes come sooner than later,” Rashid said. “One, allow rotations in the three- or four-player rule. Two, allow more than three kids under one roof as long as only three kids are receiving coaching. These two are a broader interpretations of our current rules.”
Simpler could be the answer. Perhaps over the course of time, in trying to be everything to all schools, the rule became more difficult for schools to follow, and for the MHSAA to oversee. Outside influences that could not have been predicted a generation ago have crept into the picture as well.
“These rules are very old, and that doesn’t mean not good,” Rashid said. “They were written at a time when the majority of students played multiple sports; before students began playing in 3rd and 4th grades, and before the non-school sports explosion.”
Even with the current trends and abundance of choices for some athletes, there are strong feelings from various leaders to leave things status quo.
“Our staff and league believes there needs to be a greater emphasis on the current rules with stronger punishments,” Bush said. “The answer is to enforce to current rules that we have, and not change the rules.”
There is a certain irony to this topic in front of athletic administrators and coaches, who spend so many hours in the here and now; in-season, in practices, in games.
“Who would think that what you do out of season could be the most critical piece of school sports discussion that we’ve had?” Rashid ponders. “It’s not what happens during the season, but in the offseason, that might be at the core of encouraging and maintaining school sports participation.”
Current Out-of-Season Rule (Three- or Four-Player Rule)
From MHSAA Handbook, Regulation II, Section 11(H):
2. These limitations out of season apply to coaches:
a. Outside the school season during the school year (from Monday the week of Aug. 15 through the Sunday after Memorial Day observed), school coaches are prohibited from providing coaching at any one time under one roof, facility or campus to more than three (or four) students in grades 7-12 of the district or cooperative program for which they coach (four students if the coaching does not involve practice or competition with students or others not enrolled in that school district). This applies only to the specific sport(s) coached by the coach, but it applies to all levels, junior high/middle school and high school, and both genders, whether the coach is paid or volunteer (e.g., a volunteer JV boys soccer coach may not work with more than three girls in grades 7-12 outside the girls soccer season during the school year).
![Vicksburg Athletic Department](/sites/default/files/2022-02/220215_Roy_2H.jpg)
Vicksburg AD Roy Honored Nationally for Service to School Sports
By
Pam Shebest
Special for MHSAA.com
February 15, 2022
VICKSBURG — Accepting an award on a national stage is an impressive feat for any athletic director.
But it was even more special for Vicksburg AD Mike Roy, who shared that stage with his mentor and good buddy.
While Roy was presented a Distinguished Service Award from the National Interscholastic Athletic Administrators Association in December, retired AD Mike Garvey was inducted into its Hall of Fame.
“This award from the NIAAA was exceptionally special to me because Mike got inducted the very same night into the NIAAA Hall of Fame,” Roy said.
“To be able to receive that award with someone who means so much to me and has guided me and been so influential in my career was the icing on the top, the cherry.”
Garvey said to be mentioned as Roy’s mentor “is an amazing compliment. When the Hall of Fame asked me to send some photos, I had to have him in one.”
The two men first connected 23 years ago when Garvey left Lawton High School for the AD’s job in Delton. Roy filled the Lawton position.
“Mike took me under his wing,” Roy said. “He introduced me to another great friend, Fred Smith.
“Just a couple guys who are awesome gentlemen who are recognized throughout the country.”
Garvey reflects that admiration.
“Mike Roy has been recognized in Michigan and it’s time the rest of the country knows how great he is.” Garvey said.
“It was wonderful to share the stage with him. He’s a high-energy person who attacks everything with vigor. He gets things done.”
Two years ago, Roy received the MHSAA’s Allen W. Bush for service, prompting a Roy-like comment.
“With my joking, sarcastic system, I said to myself, ‘I must be getting old because I’m starting to get these awards and being recognized for it,’” he said.
“But, really, upon hearing it, you just sit back and are really taken aback and humbled by it.”
Rooted in Paw Paw
Roy started his athletic career in Paw Paw with football, basketball, baseball and track in high school.
After turning down offers from Division III schools, Roy accepted a football scholarship to University of Nevada, Las Vegas, which was an eye-opener.
“I found out very quickly when I got to UNLV to play football that I was no longer the big fish in the pond,” he said. “I was a very small fish in a very big pond.
“Going to UNLV forced me to grow up. Sometimes when reality smacks you in the face, it kind of wakes you up.”
That experience helps him guide high school athletes today.
“Looking back now, there are some things I wish I had done on the academic side of it,” he said. “I wasn’t a great student; I wasn’t a terrible student. I wish I had done better.
“My career goal at that time, wishful as it was, was to be an NFL player.”
At UNLV, Roy earned a bachelor’s degree in physical education and health with an endorsement in driver’s education and a master’s in instructional and curricular studies.
Once back in Michigan, Roy coached golf and strength and conditioning at Kalamazoo Valley Community College, taught strength classes at Western Michigan University and was an assistant to Kalamazoo College men’s basketball coach Joe Hacklin.
Roy applied for a job at Vicksburg High School — which he did not get.
Instead, he was hired to replace Garvey at Lawton, also teaching strength and conditioning, and coaching varsity basketball.
Three years later, Roy became AD at Vicksburg, a job he has had for the last 20 years.
Accolades began piling up, including the certified master athletic administrator designation from the NIAAA in 2005, Michigan Interscholastic Athletic Administrator Association (MIAAA) Athletic Director of the Year in 2012, MIAAA president in 2019-20, NIAAA delegate at the National Federation of State High School Associations (NFHS) national conference for 10 years and being named a finalist for National Athletic Director of the Year from the National High School Coaches Association.
At the NHSCA ceremony, Roy said he noticed one of the other finalists.
“One of the guys, when I looked, I said ‘Oh my gosh. He’s been an AD for 45 years.’
“Here I’m sitting with not even half that under my belt, wondering if I’m going to get 45 years in.”
Ever humble, Roy makes a point several times of mentioning that any award he receives is a culmination of efforts from a great support staff.
“I tell people in my joking way, ‘It’s my ugly face that gets the award, but when people come to Vicksburg they meet my ticket-taker or see my game management is on point,” he said.
“I wouldn’t be able to get half this stuff if I didn’t have the athletic secretary (Rhonda VanderKamp) I have. She’s phenomenal.”
VanderKamp, who has worked with Roy all 20 years, said they work well together.
As for sharing in any awards, “I’m honored but truly he deserves those awards,” she said. “We just complement each other.
“I’m so honored when I attend some of the conferences and they go around the room and ask you how many years you’ve been an athletic secretary and how many ADs have you been through. I can say only just one. It’s awesome.”
Showing off a great home
Under Roy, Vicksburg has hosted more than 100 MHSAA postseason events, and he takes pride in the workers and facilities.
“I’ve always been big on the appearance of our facilities,” he said. “Unfortunately, the outside community doesn’t get to see our library. They don’t get to see our science labs and all the other wonderful things we have going on in the building.
“When they come to Vicksburg, they’re drawing their assumptions on how they’re treated when they walk through the gate, how do the facilities look, are the trash cans overflowing, are things broken.”
He said when the MHSAA asks or looks for people to step up and host tournaments, “We have always been willing to do that. I ask our people and they say yes, we want to bring people to Vicksburg and show off our facilities.”
Roy also implements ideas he hears at various conferences.
“I always try to network and find out who’s doing something better than I’m doing and borrow that,” he said. “The neat thing about athletic directors in our association is we’re willing to share everything.
“We’re different than coaches who have a secret play or a playbook and don’t want anybody to know those plays.”
He noted that not everyone is cut out to be an athletic director.
“Most think all I do is sit around and eat popcorn, a hot dog and watch contests and how cool that is,” he said, laughing.
He said they do not see the contact with officials and support staff, refilling of concession supplies, setting up transportation to away games, notifying parents of any changes or problems and working on game schedules for next year.
As for non-AD duties, Roy spends time with his two children: Harper, a 5-foot-8 seventh grader whom he coaches on a 12-and-under softball team; and Ryker, a fourth grader involved in football, basketball, wrestling and baseball.
Doing things the right way
Roy said former Gull Lake AD Mike Foster helped craft his philosophy that high school sports are more than just winning.
“To me, in high school educational athletics, we’re here to grow the whole child and just not teach him how to win,” he said.
“I’m hiring my coaches who are going to be the best role models for my kids. We do want to win, because it’s important, but it’s not the ultimate goal for me.”
Speaking of coaches, Roy noted that his mentor is now an employee.
“Funny thing,” he said. “Mike Garvey’s my golf coach here. I always try to surround myself with some talented individuals.”
Garvey said Roy is the only reason he agreed to coach the boys golf team, and he would not consider doing it for anyone else.
“With his coaches, they’re a family and he’s like the patriarch who shows a lot of love and respect,” Garvey said.
***
Garvey was one of 10 inductees making up the 13th class of the NIAAA Hall of Fame honored in December. Garvey served as an athletic administrator for 24 years through 2018 with stops at Lawton, Delton Kellogg, Otsego and Kalamazoo Hackett Catholic Prep. He received the MHSAA’s Allen W. Bush Award in 2015 and Charles E. Forsythe Award in 2020. He also was an assistant coach on two MHSAA Finals wrestling championship teams and as head coach led Lawton to the Class D title in 1990.
Garvey has been an active member of both the MIAAA and NIAAA and the Michigan Wrestling Coaches Association, and a member of the faculty for the NIAAA’s Leadership Training Institute while also serving as Michigan’s coordinator for the program. In retirement, he has continued to contribute to school sports in a variety of other ways as well including as a meet manager of the MHSAA’s Team Wrestling Finals at Wings Event Center in Kalamazoo.
Among additional accolades at the state and national levels, Garvey received the NIAAA’s 2016 Distinguished Service Award and the George Lovich State Award of Merit in 2009 from the MIAAA.
Pam Shebest served as a sportswriter at the Kalamazoo Gazette from 1985-2009 after 11 years part-time with the Gazette while teaching French and English at White Pigeon High School. She can be reached at [email protected] with story ideas for Calhoun, Kalamazoo and Van Buren counties.
PHOTOS (Top) Vicksburg athletic director Mike Roy gives much credit to his secretary Rhonda VanderKamp, his assistant during the entirety of his two decades at the school. (Middle) Roy takes a minute to take a photo with Donald Duck during a conference in Orlando, Fla. (Below) Roy and his children Harper and Ryker await the presentation of his MHSAA’s Allen W. Bush Award. (Photos courtesy of Mike Roy.)